Blue Pied Terms

Drew Smith · **Posted:** Mon Aug 17, 2009 8:53 am

I thought after our lively discussions

and the mention of the term spalding I thought I would do some homework. Some terms used in America such as 'loud pied' and 'dark pied' to me these terms don't make any sense and to someone new would think the a 'loud pied' is just that 'loud' noisy :roll:

Now I for one am not into Americanism and like our individualism. PA refers to pieds as 'pied' & 'reverse pied' so I started a poll to see what everyone thinks.

So my question is / Should Australians use the American term 'loud pied' & 'dark pied' or should we use PA's Aussie term 'pied' & 'reverse pied'

I think 7 days should be long enough so don’t forget to vote
Cheers Drew

P.s more polls coming

hunchy · **Joined:** Mon Jun 29, 2009 6:38 pm **Posts:** 22

Great poll Drew, Just a small point I would like to raise though. When going into a hobby you normally research your subjects before you buy. With this said most people buy a reference book. The only Australian reference book on the market is Danny Browns book in the ABK Guide to series........ This book was produced in 1998 so at least for 10 years we have been using these terms and for those who researched the internet they would have been using these same American terms long before this still.
In this reference book it refers to - split pieds, dark pieds, pied & loud pieds etc... will this not be confusing if newbies and established breeders are referencing this book with these terms which are the same as the Americans and others are making there own names up? If you are going to call some reverse pieds what are you going to replace the other names with??
Split Pieds - (new name)
Dark Pieds - (new name)
Pied- (new name)
Loud Pieds - (reverse pied)
Also if for argument sake we can import peafowl, as we can still export them, will we be ostracized by the international market with these different terms as no one will have a clue what we are talking about with these new terms?? Won't this make it a nightmare with international sales??
You see this same problem occurring in all types of animals now where the dialog has evolved differently in individual countries and no body knows what the other parties are saying in reference to colour, species, type etc....
Just a thought! or a few!

Dysart · **Posted:** Mon Aug 17, 2009 10:37 am

Its simple cobber, mate

Split Pieds - (Split Pieds )
Dark Pieds - (no such thing - just a sh@t pied)
Pied- (Pied)
Loud Pieds - (reverse pied)

Done!

On yu mate

hunchy · **Joined:** Mon Jun 29, 2009 6:38 pm **Posts:** 22

Dysart wrote:

Dark Pieds - (no such thing - just a sh@t pied)

This statement is not quiet right and I am sure other peacock breeders will say the same. I have in pen 3 - 4 dark pied females with a white cock. This pen consistently throws all well marked pied chicks. It has never thrown a white or a white flighted bird. Only ever well marked pieds. On the other hand in pen 7 - I have a beautiful pied cock who is paired to 2 white hens and 2 lovely pied hens..... The offspring produced from the white hens is fine but the pied hens produce a mixed bag as they produce normals, dark pieds and white flights as well as whites and good pieds. The % is lower for these better birds with the bulk of offspring being normals, dark pieds and white flights. These results differ to the results given by Dr Danny Brown as his table says you should produce dark pieds but not white flights and unfortunately breeding results do not lie.
So there is such a thing as Dark pieds, all of my dark pieds produced will have a tell tale sign of a group of white feathers around the size of a 5c - 10c piece somewhere on the chest or neck area and this is also the same in the hens and cocks.
So I am gathering from Dysarts response that we don't have a problem with using the American terminology we just don't like the Loud pied description and we would be opting to use Reverse Pied instead?

Pam Jackass · **Joined:** Sat Jun 18, 2005 7:21 pm **Posts:** 284

Just my tuppence worth and my genetics isn't great. The problem I see is that there are what I call split to white which are blue with the white along the wings and they are products of a white crossed with a blue. You can breed forever and never get what I called a pied which in essence is splashed with white, so when selling I always explain to people what the parents were and tell them what to expect when they breed. Most people initially don't really care as they are excited to get anything but when they start breeding they get more hooked and want to know so I keep records. Then there are those that I refer to as "dark pied" and they are the product of a recessive to pied ie with a few white feathers under the wing as our Jake had put with a white or a pied mate. They have the same appearance as the split to white but they will breed pied. I have one white female who breeds more dark pied to our recessive and the other white female breeds the more obvious pied. I like using the term "reverse pied" as basically except for the guy in NSW there are few around so I am not likely to need that term until I buy some birds from him! My other description, totally unscientific, is "in your face pied." I use that to describe the odd bird I have bred that isn't quite reverse but has a lot of white. In the horse world with Standardbreds which are pinto they use a percentage white description. To be honest I don't think it matters as long as we explain to the people we are selling to. I think it is important though to distinguish somehow between the "split to white" as I call them and the pieds showing little white (old "dark pied"). I guess overall I am in favour of the USA system and I quite like the term Spalding as it honours.... or maybe dishonours????? depending on your opinion of the hybrids, the person who did the first cross, so I am going to vote for the American system but with the rider that we distinguish between those that will never breed pieds and those that will. Hope I am not confusing things further. Pam

hunchy · **Joined:** Mon Jun 29, 2009 6:38 pm **Posts:** 22

I was wondering when split whites were going to turn up in the convo. Spot on Pam there are definitely split whites that look identical to what we call a split pied or "white flights" ............ But are these birds split pied ??? Our good pieds generally all have white in there breeding so when you produce a white flighted chick , is it a split Pied - white flighted bird or is it a split white - white flighted bird??? The plot thickens. I voted for the American way simply because the term have been used for ions, our books all have these references in them so why fix something that is not broken..... Why confuse potential customers with different terminology to those that are in print via books and the internet.........but each to there own.

Pam Jackass · **Joined:** Sat Jun 18, 2005 7:21 pm **Posts:** 284

Yes, thinking that we could even go "light pied" for the reverses..... not seriously, just the opposite to dark pied! I think stick to the American as everyone knows it but maybe individually describe the birds with a percentage white. With all our modern technology a photo is good and I send pics of the birds in question to potential customers. Pam

Dysart · **Posted:** Mon Aug 17, 2009 1:22 pm

Pied = .01 to 50% pied markings
Reverse pied = 50.1% to 99% pied markings

I does not matter what they breed its how they look.

So, no such this as dark pied, just an over kill from the yanks

bunyanuternie · **Joined:** Wed Jul 11, 2007 10:31 pm **Posts:** 2903

Mine are either ,Split,white,or pied, always have been always will be , I'm a simple man and everyone knows what I mean Split ,pied or white . :mrgreen:

My pieds are unique ( to me) but I still call them pied .

Drew Smith · **Posted:** Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:04 pm

Dysart & bunyanuternie

I put petrol in my car at the petrol station & it costs me per litre. The pump doesn't say GASOLINE & I don't pay by the GALLON or pay with US dollars

we are not sheep

Cheers Drew Smith

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